October 12, 2010: change the system, not the climate!

I guess the name speaks for its self.

Re: October 12, 2010: change the system, not the climate!

Postby Andrea on Fri Oct 08, 2010 1:27 pm

Anyway, getting back on track to the main theme of this thread, we've just done something pretty radical for 10:10:10 (http://www.1010global.org/uk)............. we've just bought a 5.5 acre woodland!! This woodland was in the hands of developers who were trying to bury the stream that was running through it into a tunnel and then dump 5000 tonnes of soil into the valley in order to level it off. their plan was to transform the site into stables for an adjoining polo field. Of course, they didn't get away with it, and in frustration, they decided to sell it. I've managed to outbid interested developers :P . We're now going to restore this heavily degraded woodland (it's full of invasive species etc). This will allow native wildlife back in and hopefully absorb lots of carbon! :mrgreen:
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Re: October 12, 2010: change the system, not the climate!

Postby jim_lewis1 on Fri Oct 08, 2010 1:38 pm

cool, if you're stuck for muscle, get the British Trust for Conservation Volunteers involved.
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Re: October 12, 2010: change the system, not the climate!

Postby Andrea on Mon Oct 11, 2010 11:16 am

jim_lewis1 wrote:if you're stuck for muscle, get the British Trust for Conservation Volunteers involved.


Thanks for the tip, Jim. I've just looked on the BTCV website and it looks like there is the community group operating near the woodland....
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Re: October 12, 2010: change the system, not the climate!

Postby Teiana on Mon Oct 11, 2010 12:02 pm

if it's private woodland (you bought it) you should pay them to help...surely volunteering should be for public stuff? Or should we all expect free gardening services?
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Re: October 12, 2010: change the system, not the climate!

Postby Andrea on Tue Oct 12, 2010 11:14 am

Teiana wrote:if it's private woodland (you bought it) you should pay them to help...surely volunteering should be for public stuff? Or should we all expect free gardening services?


That's an interesting point, especially because it's relevant to a research project I'm trying to set up in Guyana. There is a major global initiative now gathering momentum called "Payment for Ecosystem Services" (PES). It basically tries to promote the idea that individuals/communities/organisations/developing nations that own the rights to natural resources should be encouraged to maintain and enhance those natural resources that benefit society as a whole, rather than despatch these resources for a quick buck.

So, for example, I could readily sell the remaining native timber within the woodland and maybe replant it with alien, quick growing species (e.g. Sitka spruce). This would make much more economic sense than enhancing the site's native biodiversity (which makes no economic sense at all at an individual level, but actually makes a lot of economic sense for the long-term future of humanity).

In order to encourage the latter, rather than the former, there are some grants available for ecological restoration, and BTCV helps to keep the costs of restoration down with volunteer help. Since most of the land in the UK is privately owned anyway, you will find that without this kind of support, all of this country's biodiversity would have been wiped out a long time ago.

Anyway, I don't have any economic interests in this woodland whatsoever, so volunteers or no volunteers, I will still be busy restoring it! To be honest, the ecological restoration idea is a handy objective for achieving the main purpose of this woodland, which is to reduce the "nature-deficit disorder" within the local population of kids (see http://www.education.com/topic/nature-deficit-disorder/ and the review to this brilliant book: http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=_J8y ... CEkQ6AEwBw ). I've already planned a weekend camping trip for some local kids this half term :mrgreen:
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Re: October 12, 2010: change the system, not the climate!

Postby Teiana on Tue Oct 12, 2010 12:09 pm

I've already planned a weekend camping trip for some local kids this half term :mrgreen:


... all fully insured and risk-assessed...??
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Re: October 12, 2010: change the system, not the climate!

Postby Teiana on Tue Oct 12, 2010 12:18 pm

In order to encourage the latter, rather than the former, there are some grants available for ecological restoration, and BTCV helps to keep the costs of restoration down with volunteer help. Since most of the land in the UK is privately owned anyway, you will find that without this kind of support, all of this country's biodiversity would have been wiped out a long time ago.


ok.. but should people be allowed to own land they can't afford to maintain? Surely it should be sold/given back to the public/national trust/government/whoever and then be looked after by volunteers?

teams of volunteers helping rich landowners seems a bit weird to me. Like serfs on some ancient manor while sir whatever his name is sits by and gets to stay rich..

we own a garden, wrapped nicely around the house. I don't expect anyone else to come around and help look after it. We bought it, if it needs something doing we can't manage, we're responsible for paying someone else to do it. I'm not entitled to recruit teams of scouts to come along and pull up all my weeds for free..regardless of whether or not my trees are contributing positively to the local environment...
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Re: October 12, 2010: change the system, not the climate!

Postby Neill on Tue Oct 12, 2010 1:40 pm

teams of volunteers helping rich landowners seems a bit weird to me

Why?
If the landowner wants to undertake a project to increase biodiversity and is willing to allow his land to be used but doesn't want to pay for (unproductive) labour and at the same time there are people willing to do the labour -
then where is the problem?

As a scout I seem to remember working on a project in a private park and on a narrow gauge railway. I learned a lot about team work and it cost me nothing.
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Re: October 12, 2010: change the system, not the climate!

Postby Teiana on Tue Oct 12, 2010 2:38 pm

As a scout I seem to remember working on a project in a private park and on a narrow gauge railway. I learned a lot about team work and it cost me nothing.


of course it cost you nothing you were slave labour! :)
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Re: October 12, 2010: change the system, not the climate!

Postby Teiana on Tue Oct 12, 2010 2:42 pm

is willing to allow his land to be used but doesn't want to pay for (unproductive) labour and at the same time there are people willing to do the labour -


'willing' - you mean rubbing their hands together with glee that they're getting something for nothing?

let me get this straight. If landowner T says 'oh, i want to develop my land in a biodiverse way' - then they have to pay to have that done.. but if they say 'well i'll pretend to want to just let it all go to rot, then someone will come along and beg me and talk me into being 'willing' to allow projects on the land, well then i can insist that they do it all for free, since i can claim it wasn't my idea in the first place...'

uh?

am i missing something?
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